They want to built corporation №1 in the world

5 сентября, 2008

Karlygash Ezhenova

Muhtar Ablyazov, Chairman of BTA Bank Directors Council: We are on the way with those who are willing to find their destiny.

— BTA has recently revised its ambitions in a very original manner so as to survive in crisis and strive for becoming one of the leading financial groups in the world. What are you figuring on?
— There is a rule in chess – to struggle until the very end by using any possible resources. And eventually you will be rewarded.
True, we have revised our plans by focusing on internal sources of growth rather than external funding. Here we are speaking about qualitative categories: adequate strategy, efficient management, corporate governance, competitive product line, enhancement of technology, development of the principal markets of our activities: Kazakhstan, Russia, Ukraine.
First of all, in no circumstances are we going to lose our leading position in Kazakhstan. Quite the contrary, we are expecting at least 20 per cent annual growth. I think you understand that it is quite a serious decision in the current environment. BTA has started to search for new resources and managed to find plenty of them. If you look closer, you will see lots of undeveloped market segments that we are often unable to reveal. For example, a more aggressive policy on the mass segment level in Kazakhstan only will allow attracting at least 600 million US dollars of deposits until the end of the year. BTA Russia has already increased deposited amounts in Moscow only from 50-60 thousand to 2 million US dollars a day. Within the coming two years we are intended to raise this volume and reach the figure of 10 million US dollars. Target-oriented operation in the Russian, Ukrainian and Kazakh markets only should produce about 4-5 billion US dollars of deposits placed by individuals. That’s quite a modest figure. The crisis has made us gather all our strength. And become more mobile.

— Why did you claim 2% of the Russian market until 2015?
— We are expecting that the Russian BTA Bank assets in 2008 will grow more than twice and amount to 3 billion US dollars. I am sure that in the current condition of the Russian market we can grow 2-3 times a year throughout 4-5 years. And it is possible to grow in a similar way in Ukraine. These markets have a huge potential. There are still a lot of people who avoid bank services and prefer to keep their money at home. Even in Europe – taking into account its level of development – up to 40% of population do not employ bank services. In think in the CIS countries this figure is about 5-7%. We do understand that the income level here cannot be compared with the world average figure. But it will grow for sure.
I may probably seem too optimistic. But that’s the human nature: when everything is OK people believe that it will for ever be like that. And when things take a turn for the worse everybody is sure that it will never be better. I think we need to analyze the trends and then we can see that even in such situation there are opportunities for rapid development.
I am sure all the current problems are temporary. There is a more systematic, important and long-term challenge – human capital. And this is a critical issue not only for BTA and Kazakhstan but for the entire post-Soviet region. I am afraid that in this regard we have almost exhausted the stable reserve that was formed in the times of the USSR.

— To which extent is your approach applicable to Ukraine with its more specific market?
— I do agree that the Ukrainian financial market is regarded as more competitive – almost all the five largest banks are owned by western investors. But on the other hand, there are plenty of possibilities for rapid growth in Ukraine. For example, now when the whole world is suffering from the food crisis, the Ukrainian lands are in huge demand. The market has a serious energy potential. There is a possibility of integrating in Europe – it is a largest energy consumer. Owing to its geopolitical position, Ukraine will inevitably develop its transport infrastructure and machine building. The Ukrainian population – which is about 48 million – is highly educated. That’s the most important resource in the country. Huge potential. This means that the western companies operating in the market will be unable to absorb the Ukrainian growth. So I am sure that everybody will find their niche in the market.

— You have also mentioned your plans for expansion outside the CIS region. Could you tell about the time limits and basic areas of expansion?
— We have several interconnected and simultaneous areas of development. First of all, strengthening our position in the CIS countries. Second, emerging markets of Turkey and China and, most probably, Middle East. The third area includes Europe and America. In some areas we are rapidly moving forward, in others – making first steps. We have already obtained a foothold in the CIS region. Now it’s time to expand our activities to Turkey and China.
All these targets require the establishment of a vertically integrated holding patterned after the largest international financial groups. Due to the fact that the next step of our development is connected with strengthening of our position in the CIS region, probably the holding management will be located not only in Almaty but also in Moscow. That’s a logical step taking into account the fact that in the coming 5-10 years at least 80% of BTA Bank’s activities will be focused on CIS countries.
But simultaneously – as a natural growth condition – BTA will continue its integration into the international financial system. Before the year 2030, BTA is intended to be ranked among the leading banks of the world. I do understand that this may seem too ambitious. But the experience shows that in many cases the champions are those who did not have any pre-requisites to become successful. For example, HSBC, being a leader of the world financial system even in the current conditions, began to operate in post-colonial Hong-Kong, on a territory with scanty population and almost non-existent economy. Starting from 1992, HSBC has made its last huge jerk. Such examples are numerous. A number of European banks have made a large progress within the past 15 years.
To make a similar breakthrough, it is necessary to set the right goals. When BTA began to pursue an expansion strategy, it laid the basis for its growth. Not to use these opportunities means to mock the effects of the people who were building this basis. And using the opportunities means to move further, even if others start to criticize us – just as they did when we decided to expand outside Kazakhstan.
In fact, time is on our side. Let us assume that the European markets have standardized within the past 10 years in terms of entry possibilities. If we open BTA in Germany, the current legislation of the European Union will make it possible to establish branches in all states of the region quite quickly without regulators’ approval. Furthermore, the financial institutions that were intending to expand their activities in the CIS region a year ago, have revised their plans for at least 2-3 years. And BTA Bank is “hungry” in the good sense of this word, we are in good athletic shape, not used to comfort and are constantly moving forward.

— There is a massive discussion concerning the portfolio quality and growth of impaired loans. What can you say in this regard?
— Of course, the deterioration of the portfolio is obvious. But we are looking at the overall situation. We do realize that business is rapidly restructuring. The arrears amount is within reasonable limits. I can cite our bank as an example. At the end of 2007 the reserve volume was 5.4 per cent, and on 1 April 2008 the amount of provisions for the loan portfolio made up about 7 per cent. And we continue to raise it. It’s a kind of a pad for possible portfolio deterioration. The amount of profit compares well with the last year figure. So if we continue to earn a lot, it means that the market allows us to do that. In such conditions we can work for at least 12-18 months. Within this period of time everything will be restructured and adjusted. And then new growing points will arise – a new challenge.

What was the reason for postponing IPO entry until 2010?
IPO is not an end in itself. The profit that we are currently earning is sufficient for our growth. We have not cancelled our plans for autumn 2009, yet we are afraid that the hard situation in the financial market will hold. Multipliers are low. On this price level there is no necessity in joining IPO.

— What is leadership for BTA – geographic expansion or technology breakthrough?
— Globalization has to a certain extent leveled the geographic factor. Therefore, apart from strengthening out position in the markets, we are planning to achieve technological leadership that will ensure high-quality services provided to our customers. In general, leadership is being actively shifted to the delicate sphere: intellectual, ideological, cultural. I consider this to be a progressive trend.
Good quality of our assets, corporate management and advanced IT-technology should allow us to update continuously without changing our essence. It’s impossible to implement an established strategy ignoring the changing world. The ability to feel the slightest changes in the environment is the guarantee of successful growth. Finally, the most important thing is that our customers should always feel that we are greatly interested in their well-being, and, therefore, we are working for the sake of their business growth, and working better than the customers expect.

— BTA Bank is also known for its nontrivial step – you have invited the renowned writer Chingiz Aitmatov as an Independent Director in the Board of Directors. Unfortunately, your plans were not to be implemented. Nevertheless, what prompted such an unusual decision?
— Any business implies something else besides money. The financial system is a mechanism that ensures the dialog between economies. And, as a consequence, it is a dialogue between people, cultures, civilizations. We cannot underestimate this factor. The BTA Group strategy is currently focused on the dialogue between people that have the same cultural background, and Aitmatov is one of its brightest representatives. The generation that makes decisions today includes the people who were growing with Aitmatov’s books. Nowadays business lacks culture in the global sense of this word. And vice versa. For me personally, Aitmatov is especially close because he managed to remind people about eternal human values in his original manner. That’s what makes me also close to Okudzhava. His songs help you to remain true to yourself. All his creative works are filled with struggle for internal human freedom.

Roman Solodchenko, BTA Bank Chairman of Board: We must shift from “management” to “leadership”.

«There is something predefined in everybody’s life. As for me, it shows itself in the fact that I went to school with the English language base. I liked learning the language so much that later I started learning it on my own; I’m still learning it and exploring more and more new facets. On graduating from the institute, at first I was going to become a scientist, then a broker at the goods and raw materials exchange, and in the end I entered the Kazakhstan Institute of Management, Economics, and Strategic Research that was the only educational institution where instructors were live foreigners. Thanks to my previous language training I was taken to the advanced group that was instructed by an American journalist; in two months I found myself in the list of candidates to work for the representative office of Canadian consulting company СESO. In spite of the fact that I kept saying ‘well… well…’ at the interview (I thought that I was saying “хорошо-хорошо” and in the fact it was “ну…ну…”) they hired me; and those $300 that I got for the representative office opening were the best present for my mother’s birthday in my life. With that my career began; and whatever skills I’ve acquired afterward, while introducing me to someone my chiefs and colleagues invariably start my characterization with my language knowledge.»

— You told once that you like learning but not working. Are you a pathological A-student?
— Good God, no! I just got marvelous training. At Republican School of Physics and Mathematics I was a C-student most of the times, but not a hard worker; but my knowledge was enough to graduate from the institute with honors. We were taught to study, not to drill. When one masters the “mechanics” of this process, one can independently study almost any discipline. In my opinion it is the main basic skill that school should develop. I like learning and comprehending something new, at first I acquired knowledge, then as memory cells are being filled up the accent moves to skills accumulation. This process is never-ending, but one enjoys it properly only after the minimum necessary for life is accumulated and one is able to choose what to study next. Four years ago I made so to speak an inventory of accumulated experience and made a list of skills that I’d like to acquire. I must say that 70% of the list I fulfilled while working at Turan Alem Bank. These are skills of leadership, conflict management, communication, and presentation. Among unfulfilled remained sport and creative work; I still dream to dance; I’d like to master French which I started learning after I left public service.

— Can one say that you program yourself?
— Only to a certain extent. I never define strictly the ways of object achieving and let the destiny choose the best course. At the same time I clearly picture the final result. This approach has deep historical roots. Our ancestors whichever religion they belonged to never forgot to start the statements about future plans with a saying “God grant”. Any statements regarding future events are strictly regulated even in the modern prospects of securities emission. The most important in this approach is to keep to the centre of the event stream and not to hinder defined objectives in their realization. One can found oneself in the back-water, we call it deadlock situations. In this case one should carefully (not to hit the bank) try one way or another until one pull oneself to the rapids.

— It is a very strange position for a top-manager.
— Perhaps, but on the other hand I don’t tend to consider myself as a model top-manager. On the contrary, every day I try to prove to myself and to others that I’m qualified enough to hold this position.

-What do you prefer: to manage staff or processes?
— I don’t quite understand the essence of such a choice; to manage processes without staff is possible only on completely robotized factory, as for staff management I think that nowadays this notion is applicable only to strictly regulated organizations, for instance an army or Emergency Control Ministry, where a subordinate is to follow orders without any exception. Such a command system doesn’t work in organizations that aim at higher work efficiency. The only way to get an employee’s maximum is to create such conditions in which he or she would seek after it. It means that the notion “management” is slowly being replaced by the notion “leadership”. A leader doesn’t give orders, but sets goals and inspires people to realize them.

— What do you consider your strong and weak points?
— The answer on this question is fuller and more argumentative when it’s given by a direct executive or by direct subordinates. I think that my main characteristics are orientation toward common humane values, positive spirit, and perhaps a sense of humor. Though they say that a person who says that he or she appreciate sense of humor in fact seeks an auditory that would laughed at their jokes, as for me, it is an important skill for survival like a skill in swimming. As many things in our life these characteristics have a reverse side. I can hardly handle the situations requiring strict administration; I can underestimate the gravity of a problem or take an unnecessarily principled stand. Everyone has their flaws, and for an organization it is important not to struggle with them but to know how they are compensated with the strong points of the other team members.

— What do you think caused the growth of Turan Alem Bank?
— First of all, it is the same factors that contributed to the growth of all Kazakhstan banks: (i) rapid development of bank sector called forth by the favorable regulatory climate and general economical growth in the growing energy carrier prices environment and (ii) prolonged quite period at the financial world markets. Our strategy fundamentally differed from that of other banks in the realization of opportunities concerning the low barriers of neighbor countries markets entering. Today it is impossible even for a big international bank to repeat such a breakthrough to the CIS and neighboring foreign countries markets; the reason of it is that the situation has changed and a window of opportunities has been shut. For instance, Raiffeisen Bank that announced more than once its strategic interests at the Kazakhstan financial market was not able to provide its presence here on a grand scale. The other foreign banks operating here were moved from 3-4th position far below the top ten; and they will hardly return their positions in the foreseeable future. On the other hand, it will be difficult for our close competitors to expand their activity in the CIS and even in Turkey as such a strategy requires heavy withdrawal of resources. The second distinguishing feature of our bank is the very idea of the creation of a single bank for the CIS and neighboring foreign countries. As any other grandiose idea it gets a response from our investors, our clients and our employees as well; it gives us a considerable credit limit that helps us to overcome the situations of downturn at world financial markets. We didn’t aim at counting the value of our main non-material assets, but I’m sure it amounts to hundreds of millions if not billions dollars.

— What do you consider your uniqueness for Turan Alem Bank?
— Thanks to my previous experience in business I am a bearer of the western values; at the same time my soul is flesh of my motherland flesh. The combination of these characteristics is most likely to determine a call for me working in the bank at the transitional stage. During our development we faced both the period of wild market and the period of unrestrained growth. Now it is time for a position struggle when business competition is shifting from logical to emotional sphere, when the fight is arising for every client, but not for dominance in this or another region, when one hundredth percent matters, when our direct rivals aren’t people known from youth, but experienced western bankers of the second or third generation. New times make new demands; and bank administration should be in the hands of different professionals. A sprinter should give place to a stayer; a winner of “Paris-Dakar” rally should take the steering-wheel instead of a motocross winner. The Kazakhstan bank sector forces alignment for the next five years depends on the speed and effectiveness of this process.

Henry Holodzinskiy, deputy of BTA Bank Chairman of Board: Who wants to realize their dreams find the ways, those who don’t want to – look for reasons.

— You are one of those few BTA Top Managers who can speak about the Bank in terms of succession, management, and traditions. What is BTA like now: a bank with 87-year history or a young ambitious bank established in 1998?
— I can tell you part of my story, and then you can make your own judgment. I was 22 when a new director came to the factory. On Sunday, he looked round the factory for the very first time. Obviously, the security guards told him that there was a worker in the design department. Then an unfamiliar man entered the department without introducing himself. At that moment I was standing at the drawing board making a project on the “theory of mechanisms and machines”. As a graduate of an aircraft institute, he became interested. He checked the drawings, noted the high accuracy of graphic calculations, talked to me for a while and left.
On Monday I was invited to the Director’s office. I was very surprised to see the previous day interlocutor in front of me, his name was V.G. Pankratov. He said he had an idea to create a complex of auxiliary services at the factory and offered me…. to be the head of this complex. I decided it was a joke and asked for some time to think it over. Director said, “This means you a man of no character”. I objected, and he replied that I had to take a decision that very moment, otherwise he would never offer me anything.
Young age had its effect. I agreed saying that I would be working day and night, but if I did not manage to do something, I shouldn’t be blamed. He was satisfied with my reply and an hour later a got my appointment. Actually that work rhythm remained for the whole of my life. I think this person predetermined a lot in my life. During those Soviet Union times this was, to put it mildly, a nonstandard decision taken by the head of a factory.
From the very first day there was a lot of responsibility. On the second day I tried to make excuses, then Director asked me to go back to the reception, leave the door open and read loudly the bronze slogan on the poster: “those who want to do something look for the ways, those who do not – look for the reasons”. This type of influence was used twice again. But for me it became a most important rule in business and life. Ten years later I became head of the factory.
We do understand – life is cyclic. Everything is repeated, only on a new, more sophisticated level. When I left politics in August 1991, I was offered to head a branch of Vnesheconombank of Kazakhstan. This was something new for me, and I agreed. The branch started its operation having two people on the staff – me and the accountant, and one room on the fourth floor of the building which is now the Regional Akimat (administration). Vnesheconombank of Kazakhstan had no resources as it became autonomous from the USSR Vnesheconombank.
We collected the authorized capital on our own, for five months we lived on our personal savings only. At that tine I worked out the plan of the branch development for 10 years. By the end of the period it was planned to reach the profit margin of 10-15 million US dollars. Everybody thought I was mad. But we succeeded… thought with adjustments, due to numerous bank restructurings. No one can avoid them. In fact, the branch was operating as “a bank in the bank. A bit later I was dreaming of establishing a regional bank that would have relationships with Russia. I succeeded again… only in BTА. And now – a new wave of CIS and foreign countries. Life is a wonderful thing.

— Do you think BTA began to work with the small and medium business segment at the right moment?
— If we look 10-15 years back, we can say that the banks Turan and Alem, and since 1997 the consolidated bank TuranAlem, were focusing on corporate customers. The corporate unit is still the largest sector of the Bank that has a highly organized management and adequate bank service provided to customers.
Except for a few branches, the bank began to develop its SMB unit since 2000 only. A more active stage of development started in 2006. Within 18 months, the lending volume has grown from 650 mln. to 2,200 mln. US dollars in Kazakhstan only. The market share has increased from 11.2 to 18.6 per cent. Almost 100 mln. US dollars of profit in 2007 was earned by SMB unit.

— Small and medium businesses are not experiencing their best times now. How are you planning to grow?
— Unfortunately, this problem exists. Imbalance in Kazakhstan housing construction and the world financial crisis have influenced small and medium business development.
We had to make a pause in the lending process, reveal the essence of the current events, and work out the appropriate measures. We were mostly concerned about the crisis in housing construction rather than the world crisis. It was necessary to understand the profundity of these problems, breadth of economic sectors, the number of companies involved in construction. Actually, this pause was also important for the customers. We have analyzed the challenges within a very short time and made conclusions. Then we made stress tests, updated the existing banking products and are currently developing the new products for SMB. We find the quality of the portfolio quite satisfactory. This can be proved by the fact that the share of debts over 90 days past due amounts to only 0.85%, and in large branches this figure is twice as low. My experience proves that MSB is the first sector that suffers from crises, but it is also the first that can be restored.
We are beginning to increase the volume of loans extended. The market share is gradually growing after the overall pause in Kazakhstan. We are working out different approaches for our CIS and foreign subdivisions. And we intend to go on consistently implementing our part of BTA strategic development plan.

— But why should an entrepreneur choose BTA?
— The entrepreneurs have chosen BTA long ago. Apart from all other features: reliability, conditions, service, we have always succeeded in being more focused on the market – not on politics. You can believe me that’s an important issue which is proved by the fact that during the lending pause, the number of our customers did not drop – it only increased.
We are more attentive to the customers’ business development. We have developed a program for nascent entrepreneurs and created the adequate products. It is very important in the current conditions. Besides, BTA network in CIS and foreign countries will be able to offer very good product packages to entrepreneurs in the near future.

— What is the current status of SMB in Kazakhstan and CIS countries? What are the actual problems of the middle class? And what would you advise them?
— SMB in Kazakhstan is experiencing the consequences of crisis in housing construction, businesses and loans are leveling out. This process will last up to 1-2 years.
Crisis has certainly squeezed up small and medium business and created uncomfortable conditions for many entrepreneurs. But on the other hand, crisis has made business less vulnerable. Business is developing protective immunity against crises. You can see it in many firms.
In CIS this problem is less painful for us since the market share is not significant.
My advice for entrepreneurs is to be tolerant and persistently overcome hardships that may arise in a possible emergency situation.

— You have a wonderful Soviet background. But the putsch has ruined everything. Or hasn’t’? Do you miss the Soviet Union times? Which experience is mostly important for BTA that is planning to operate in the post-Soviet region?
— I do have an interesting life. The putsch did not do any harm to me personally. I am only sorry that such a vast power has collapsed. Today it might have been a powerful domestic market. Just imagine everything owned by CIS countries at present – twice or thrice as much, what a huge potential that might be.
However, those times cannot be returned. We need to live in real life mode and make all possible efforts to let our business grow. We should do our best to make the countries where BTA is operating wealthier and people happier.

George Iosifyan, member of the Board BTA: All you need is corporate governance and strong IT.

— At present we are actively trying to introduce something which is referred to as “international (western) standards”. These principles might work or will be working, or can only work within a certain system that is based on a stable foundation. But the trouble is that for the time being they are not quite suitable for CIS due to the lack of system, rules of play or proper institutions…
— Based on my own experience I cannot fully agree with that. The Russian company ROSNO invited me for the purpose of implementing its strategy of development, performing takeover/merger transactions and expanding its activities to other regions. It is quite obvious that I started working in an American style, i.e. applying American principles of work. And of course I encountered great resistance. Although some Germans from Alliance head office had already been working in Rosno, they were mainly dealing with technical and technological issues, estimating insurance risks and underwriting. And as far as corporate development and strategy are concerned, this was still a Russian company. At that time many people told me that here it will not work, the Russians have a different mentality, that it is hardly possible to introduce all this. But then it turned out that it is. Thought it was not me who did it. This happened after Alliance purchased the whole Rosno and replaced several managers. Now everything is just fine, and Rosno is moving forward becoming increasingly strong insurance company.

— Do you mean that replacement of management is the only way out?
— What I want to say is that if we analyze return to share capital and growth of shares, even among the Russian companies the leaders are the companies that have strong corporate governance. No matter how strange this may seem, effectiveness of corporate governance depends on efficient IT. One of the main principles of corporate governance is the system of checks and balances, accountability and control which implies that all directions are to be regularly checked, controlled and provided with feedback. This system does not only apply to financial, PNL and balance sheet statements. It applies to all indicators in all areas. Efficient IT system which makes it possible to provide timely and adequate information enables management to properly organize its work, make appropriate decisions and efficiently govern the process. If we want to achieve the results we are talking about we need a modern efficient IT-system. I believe we should not hesitate to invest in its installation.
Another direction is not as complex as the first two (corporate governance and IT-system) – it is necessary to analyze the western financial products. I dare say that in spite of all the current problems in the American market of mortgage securities, American banking system and products they offer to their customers are the most developed ones. This is true about everything: product line, positioning, marketing and even giving the customer an opportunity to choose the credit card design, for example, with the picture of landscape, national flag, etc. I am not spe